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  1. #1

    Default Φωσφατιδικό Οξύ (Phosphatidic Acid) - Μάπα Το Καρπούζι;

    Ενα αρκετα δημοφιλες συμπληρωμα που βλεπουμε ολο και περισσοτερο σε διαφορα προιοντα που υποσχονται μυικη αναπτυξη. Οι διαφορες μελετες ομως τι λενε για αυτο?

    1η ερευνα, λεει πως ενεργοποιει το mTor αρκετα και επομενως και την υπερτροφια.

    Phosphatidic acid enhances mTOR signaling and resistance exercise induced hypertrophy

    The lipid messenger phosphatidic acid (PA) plays a critical role in the stimulation of mTOR signaling. However, the mechanism by which PA stimulates mTOR is currently unknown. Therefore, the purpose of this study was to compare the effects of various PA precursors and phospholipids on their ability to stimulate mTOR signaling and its ability to augment resistance training-induced changes in body composition and performance.

    Methods
    In phase one, C2C12 myoblasts cells were stimulated with different phospholipids and phospholipid precursors derived from soy and egg sources. The ratio of phosphorylated p70 (P-p70-389) to total p70 was then used as readout for mTOR signaling. In phase two, resistance trained subjects (n?=?28, 21?±?3 years, 77?±?4 kg, 176?±?9 cm) consumed either 750 mg PA daily or placebo and each took part in an 8 week periodized resistance training program.

    Results
    In phase one, soy-phosphatidylserine, soy-Lyso-PA, egg-PA, and soy-PA stimulated mTOR signaling, and the effects of soy-PA (+636%) were significantly greater than egg-PA (+221%). In phase two, PA significantly increased lean body mass (+2.4 kg), cross sectional area (+1.0 cm), and leg press strength (+51.9 kg) over placebo.

    Conclusion
    PA significantly activates mTOR and significantly improved responses in skeletal muscle hypertrophy, lean body mass, and maximal strength to resistance exercise.

    ----

    2η ερευνα
    εγινε με συγκεκριμενο προιον απο εταιρεια, αλλα και παλι το αποτελεσμα ηταν πως το PA ειχε θετικο αποτελεσμα στην αυξηση του αλιπου μυικου ιστου:

    The effects of phosphatidic acid supplementation on strength, body composition, muscular endurance, power, agility, and vertical jump in resistance trained men.
    Escalante G1, Alencar M2, Haddock B1, Harvey P3.

    Phosphatidic acid (PA) is a lipid messenger that has been shown to increase muscle protein synthesis via signaling stimulation of the mammalian target of rapamycin (mTOR). MaxxTOR? (MT) is a supplement that contains PA as the main active ingredient but also contains other synergistic mTOR signaling substances including L-Leucine, Beta-Hydroxy-Beta-Methylbutyrate (HMB), and Vitamin D3.

    METHODS:
    Eighteen healthy strength-trained males were randomly assigned to a group that either consumed MT (n?=?8, 22.0 +/- 2.5 years; 175.8 +/- 11.5 cm; 80.3 +/- 15.1 kg) or a placebo (PLA) (n?=?10, 25.6 +/- 4.2 years; 174.8 +/- 9.0 cm; 88.6 +/- 16.6 kg) as part of a double-blind, placebo controlled pre/post experimental design. All participants volunteered to complete the three day per week resistance training protocol for the eight week study duration. To determine the effects of MT, participants were tested on one repetition maximum (1RM) leg press strength (LP), 1RM bench press strength (BP), push-ups to failure (PU), vertical jump (VJ), pro-agility shuttle time (AG), peak power output (P), lean body mass (LBM), fat mass (FM), and thigh muscle mass (TMM). Subjects were placed and monitored on an isocaloric diet consisting of 25 protein, 50 carbohydrates, and 25 % fat by a registered dietitian. Separate two-way mixed factorial repeated measures ANOVA's (time [Pre, Post] x group [MT and PLA] were used to investigate strength, body composition, and other performance changes. Post-hoc tests were applied as appropriate. Analysis were performed via SPSS with significance at (p???0.05).

    RESULTS:
    There was a significant main effect (F(1,16)?=?33.30, p?<?0.001) for LBM where MT significantly increased LBM when compared to the PLA group (p?<?0.001). Additionally, there was a significant main effect for LP (F(1,16)?=?666.74, p?<?0.001) and BP (F(1,16)?=?126.36, p?<?0.001) where both increased significantly more in MT than PLA group (p?<?0.001). No significant differences between MT and PLA were noted for FM, TMM, VJ, AG, P, or PU.

    CONCLUSION:
    The results of this eight week trial suggest that the addition of MaxxTOR? to a 3-day per week resistance training program can positively impact LBM and strength beyond the results found with exercise alone.

    ----

    3η ερευνα μελετησε το αποτελεσμα του phospatidic acid σε δυναμη και μυικη πυκνοτητα, και δεν βρεθηκε κανενα θετικο στοιχειο σε σχεση με placebo:


    Effects of phosphatidic acid supplementation on muscle thickness and strength in resistance-trained men

    Adam M Gonzalez, Katie M. Sell, Jamie J Ghigiarelli, Christopher F Kelly, Edward W Shone, Matthew R Accetta, Jamie B Baum, Gerald T Mangine

    The purpose of this study was to investigate the effects of phosphatidic acid (PA) supplementation on muscle thickness and strength following an 8-week supervised resistance-training program. Fifteen resistance trained men (22.8±3.5 y; 80.6±8.7 kg; 178.1±5.6 cm; 14.6±8.8% body fat) were randomly assigned to a group that either consumed 750 mg of PA or a placebo (PL). Testing was carried out before (PRE) and after (POST) training/supplementation for muscle thickness and strength. Muscle thickness of the rectus femoris (RF), vastus lateralis (VL), biceps brachii (BB), and triceps brachii (TB) muscles were measured via ultrasonography along with one repetition maximum (1RM) of squat, deadlift, and bench press. Analysis of covariance, using PRE values as the covariate, did not reveal any group differences for measures of muscle thickness in the RF (PA: 3.6±5.2%; PL: 3.2±4.2%, p=0.97), VL (PA: 23.4±18.1%, PL: 12.5±15.4%, p=0.37), BB (PA: 3.7±6.4%, PL: 9.6±12.4%, p=0.86), or TB (PA: 15.1±17.9%, PL: 10.7±19.3%, p=0.79). Likewise, no group differences were observed in changes in squat (PA: 8.4±4.1%, PL: 8.1±4.2%, p=0.79), deadlift (PA: 10.1±10.1%, PL: 8.9±9.5%, p=0.66), or bench press (PA: 5.7±5.5%, PL: 5.1±3.0%, p=0.76) exercises. Collectively, however, all participants experienced significant (p<0.05) improvements in each measure of muscle thickness and strength. Results of this study suggest that PA supplementation, in combination with a 3 days·week-1 resistance-training program for 8-weeks, did not have a differential effect compared to PL on changes in muscle thickness or 1RM strength.


    "
    Do all the good you can, for all the people you can, in all the ways you can, as long as ever you can."

    "You got a dream, you gotta protect it. If people can't do something themselves, they wanna tell you that you can't do it. If you want something, go get it. Period."
    ~ Chris Gardner


    "Just remember that you are doing something that so few people in the world have the will power or determination to do. It takes much more than physical strength for us to build and sculpt our bodies. It takes an enormous amount of mental strength as well, and that's what people are truly jealous of. Take it as a compliment, for you stand out in a crowd full of followers."


    "Αισχρον δε και το δια την αμελειαν γηραναι, πριν ιδειν εαυτον ποιος αν καλλιστος και κρατιστος τω σωματι γενοιτο • ταυτα δε ουκ εστιν ιδειν αμελουντα • ου γαρ εθελει αυτοματα γιγνεσθαι." ~ Σωκράτης (Ξενοφών, Απομνημονεύματα).

  2. #2
    Senior Bodybuilder Secret of Steel's Avatar
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    Κώστα είσαι πραγματικά μέσα στο μυαλό μου. Το ψάχνω φουλ τον τελευταίο καιρό διαβάζοντας μελέτες.
    Ρώτησα και ένα φίλο που είναι προπονητής και ξέρει καλά από συμπληρώματα αλλά δεν τον είδα ζεστό.
    (τώρα βέβαια θα μου πεις και για τα BCAA, λευκίνη, HMB θα ακούσεις διάφορες αντικρουόμενες απόψεις. μη σου πω ακόμα και την κρεατίνη).
    Επειδή είμαι της λογικής του ότι κάθε συμπλήρωμα δεν έχει την ίδια απόδοση σε όλους (προσωπικό παράδειγμα εγώ, τα stims δε με ακουμπάνε καν ενώ σε άλλους τους κάνουν να παθαίνουν τρέμουλα), σκεφτόμουν να το δοκιμάσω.

    Αυτό που παίζει στην αγορά σε φτηνές τιμές (έξω) είναι το King. Έχεις άποψη?

  3. #3

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    King της σειρας Jay Cutler Nutrition? Ναι το ξερω, αλλα νομιζω εχει αποσυρθει πλεον.


    "
    Do all the good you can, for all the people you can, in all the ways you can, as long as ever you can."

    "You got a dream, you gotta protect it. If people can't do something themselves, they wanna tell you that you can't do it. If you want something, go get it. Period."
    ~ Chris Gardner


    "Just remember that you are doing something that so few people in the world have the will power or determination to do. It takes much more than physical strength for us to build and sculpt our bodies. It takes an enormous amount of mental strength as well, and that's what people are truly jealous of. Take it as a compliment, for you stand out in a crowd full of followers."


    "Αισχρον δε και το δια την αμελειαν γηραναι, πριν ιδειν εαυτον ποιος αν καλλιστος και κρατιστος τω σωματι γενοιτο • ταυτα δε ουκ εστιν ιδειν αμελουντα • ου γαρ εθελει αυτοματα γιγνεσθαι." ~ Σωκράτης (Ξενοφών, Απομνημονεύματα).

  4. #4
    Senior Bodybuilder Αλεξανδρος Μπ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Musclemar View Post
    King της σειρας Jay Cutler Nutrition? Ναι το ξερω, αλλα νομιζω εχει αποσυρθει πλεον.
    Οταν το ειχα δοκιμασει το king νομιζω ηταν μονο placebo ενιωθα μια διαφορα για καμια βδομαδα και μετα τπτ,νομιζω οτι πλεον βγαζουν συμπληρωματα οχι για να κανουν δουλεια αλλα για να πιασουν πελατες απο το placebo

  5. #5

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    Και εγω το ειχε κοιταξει αλλα εριξα ακυρο γιατι δεν ελεγε τι ποσοτητες ειχε μεσα ακριβως.


    "
    Do all the good you can, for all the people you can, in all the ways you can, as long as ever you can."

    "You got a dream, you gotta protect it. If people can't do something themselves, they wanna tell you that you can't do it. If you want something, go get it. Period."
    ~ Chris Gardner


    "Just remember that you are doing something that so few people in the world have the will power or determination to do. It takes much more than physical strength for us to build and sculpt our bodies. It takes an enormous amount of mental strength as well, and that's what people are truly jealous of. Take it as a compliment, for you stand out in a crowd full of followers."


    "Αισχρον δε και το δια την αμελειαν γηραναι, πριν ιδειν εαυτον ποιος αν καλλιστος και κρατιστος τω σωματι γενοιτο • ταυτα δε ουκ εστιν ιδειν αμελουντα • ου γαρ εθελει αυτοματα γιγνεσθαι." ~ Σωκράτης (Ξενοφών, Απομνημονεύματα).

  6. #6
    Senior Bodybuilder Secret of Steel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Musclemar View Post
    Και εγω το ειχε κοιταξει αλλα εριξα ακυρο γιατι δεν ελεγε τι ποσοτητες ειχε μεσα ακριβως.
    Αν θυμάμαι καλά και η Scitec έχει κάποιο προϊόν που το εμπεριέχει. Μπορούμε να μάθουμε info ?

  7. #7

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    Mastodon της Scitec, με 750mg μεσα!


    "
    Do all the good you can, for all the people you can, in all the ways you can, as long as ever you can."

    "You got a dream, you gotta protect it. If people can't do something themselves, they wanna tell you that you can't do it. If you want something, go get it. Period."
    ~ Chris Gardner


    "Just remember that you are doing something that so few people in the world have the will power or determination to do. It takes much more than physical strength for us to build and sculpt our bodies. It takes an enormous amount of mental strength as well, and that's what people are truly jealous of. Take it as a compliment, for you stand out in a crowd full of followers."


    "Αισχρον δε και το δια την αμελειαν γηραναι, πριν ιδειν εαυτον ποιος αν καλλιστος και κρατιστος τω σωματι γενοιτο • ταυτα δε ουκ εστιν ιδειν αμελουντα • ου γαρ εθελει αυτοματα γιγνεσθαι." ~ Σωκράτης (Ξενοφών, Απομνημονεύματα).

  8. #8
    Senior Bodybuilder Secret of Steel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Musclemar View Post
    Mastodon της Scitec, με 750mg μεσα!
    Σωστός!!!! Δε θυμόμουν το όνομα. Πάντως δεν το έχω δει να παίζει εδώ Ελλάδα γενικά
    (αλλά δεν μπορεί όλο και κάποιος θα το έχει δοκιμάσει).

    Τώρα θα μου πεις προς τί η πρεμούρα.......τελείως μεταξύ μας.....δε με ενδιαφέρει για lean body mass και λοιπά χαχαχαχαχα
    Το έχω συνειδητοποιήσει ότι υπερτροφία με φυσικό τρόπο ΕΙΔΙΚΑ στην ηλικία μου, θέλει Ιώβειο υπομονή (και πάλι δεν θα έχει καμία σχέση με τα αποτελέσματα ενός πιτσιρικά). Με ενδιαφέρει καθαρά για θέμα δύναμης (όχι, δεν το πάω για power lifter, άλλωστε δεν νομίζω ότι θα μπορούσα. Αλλά θέλω να ανέβω γενικά σε δύναμη και ειδικά για το στόχο που ανέφερα στο άλλο σου ποστ)

 

 

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